MLPA Meeting!

[Holy Mackerel]

Any of you smackfishers gonna show up and support Tommy, and the rest of the RSG? We are getting bent over here!!!

As you have seen Steve's thread. If you love fishing SOCAL, read EVERY WORD! You all should be outraged!

This is serious business at this point, this next BRTF meeting is going to be the breaking point, of how business is conducted.

Some of you were in the trenches at the Oxnard meeting where ~30 RSG members turned in a letter stating that the process needs to be slowed down for many reasons, among them needing time to review the science to be able to make an informed decision. This was because the RSG members were literally given the information the day before the meeting. The BRFT paid lip service to this letter, and the RSG members request, essentially, telling them to make due, and they are moving forward.

Well, the RSG members did make due, and worked hard in good faith, to move forward and find consensus. As you read, 6 of the 7 maps were to move forward, and External C (CLOSE IT ALL) got voted out.

A dozen non-consumptive RSG members complained to the BRFT, and so Ken Wiseman moved all 7 maps forward, including External C.

This undermines the process, and the good faith effort made by the RSG members. Had the most minimal MPA maps been voted out, do you think the BRFT would have pushed it forward? No.

EVERYONE needs to attend this next meeting, and shut it down. This is supposed to be a fair proces, External C was fairly voted out from the list of maps. This process should not continue on, if the BRFT is not going respect the MAJORITY of the RSG Membership decisions, and treat one group more favorably than the other.

June 4th, 2009
9:40AM Public Comment
Sheraton Gateway Los Angeles Hotel *
6101 West Century Boulevard
Los Angeles, CA 90045

Who is going to this next meeting?

Kayak Fishermen, and Spearos are mobilizing, please attend!!!!!

:zingpow::gothand::exciter::goatrain::3pac::nocond oms::rotfl::pride::birdieluvsewe::sun-smile::confused::redi-dream::idiot:

[Holy Mackerel]

14 replies to weekend roll call, and none here?!?! Next year, weekend roll call, will be a non-fishing roll call. You guys will get what you deserve if you don't show up, and stand up for yourselves.

[bluefin2na]

Hell yeah, go get em Chris. I myslef love driving for hours and hours, then having to listen to a bunch of 26 year old young women talk about habiat and fishing, then tell me i dont know what i,m talking about.

Oh, the joy of these fucking meetings are the best, i would rather take a squid jig up the ass, and get slow trolled for great whites then go to another meeting, however my friends (thats you fucking fags) fish all the time, so i,m fighting the fight for them and for the kids that are up and coming.....

You bass slinging dudes best get ready to learn to fish trout


WE NEED HELP

come on Ooliee, get inthe game here we need help

[Holy Mackerel]

I feel much better today!

So who's coming? :rotfl:

[landwhale]

What you guys figure what good would it do you are so f ning wrong we already have made a differance and that comes from members of the RSG. At the least someone could respond to this post

[birdie]

if I could I would

[dirfter]

What you guys figure what good would it do you are so f ning wrong we already have made a differance and that comes from members of the RSG. At the least someone could respond to this post

Well, even pirates fight while they are drowning. I had plans to be up here on Friday, if anyone can help me understand how I can make a difference on Thursday I will certainly change my plans.

[Holy Mackerel]

dr fter
i


Strength in numbers. The more outraged people to voice their concerns the better. If someone honestly cant make it, ie they are having surgery that day, it is understandable. Because, I honestly cant make it due to work, but I am going any way. We have very few chances left. What the BRFT did to move forward the most closure filled proposal despite the democratic vote is BS. I hope you guys can attend, sorry my previous rant, I am frustrated. Btw, I used to think these meetings would just work themselves out, this process would yield fair and sensible MPA's. NOPE.

[dirfter]

I suggest anyone interested in the topic go here: http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/marine-life-protection-act-initiative-mlpa/

I'll be there to show support. If anyone wants a ride up I will be leaving ass early because I loathe traffic. After the meeting I will need to rush to Santa Monica for a meeting then leave by 2:30 back to SD.

[oOlie]

if i get my car running before thursday, i'm down.

[dirfter]

if i get my car running before thursday, i'm down.


The parking at this place is horrible. Carpool with National? :3pac:

[dirfter]

Update: I will be leaving 5 am then having breakfast in M Beach before going to the Sheraton. After the meeting I will be bouncing all around and won't be able to have rider(s), but if you just need a ride there (you could always fly back) let me know.

Also, be advised that the parking at this venue is terrible. Coincidence? :redi-dream:

Lastly, I contacted the LA Times Outdoors/Action Sports writer and he is going to try and be there to cover the meeting.

[Holy Mackerel]

BUMP! :zingpow:

[Holy Mackerel]

BREAKING NEWS--TEAM: KEN WISEMAN BACKED OFF ON EXTERNAL C

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

But weasel words regarding incorporating "all external proposals" and putting blame on "block voting" by consumptive RSGs still generate significant concerns.

The rules are changing on the RSG fast and furious. At least it's now back-pedaling.

Still count on showing up for the meeting. I count this as a victory in muscle-flexing exercise on the consumptive side but I wouldn't trust this snake. It is known that these sites are heavily monitored.

We are revising the strategy as we speak. Keep your engine warm.

Please stay tuned.


EVERY MAN COUNTS, SHOW UP THURS!!!!

[Holy Mackerel]

This may be smoke n mirrors guys... read Zen's post below.

Let's take stock team. The initial impression ain't what it seems.

Okay, just got off the phone. It's been a nut house. I had to cut off one RSG member (sorry dude...)so I can go and take a leak--it's been a 3 coffee-pot morning.

Phone now on no-disturb so I can type this out.

My first pass, putting on my five-cent lawyer hat and having a few minutes in between calls to look at this, is that the change is a mere change in form and not substance. Chris Fiero independently came up with the same conclusion.

"A Round 3 process may include suggestion by the BRTF of which proposals SCRSG members may use as a starting place for Round 3 negotiations or identification of very similar proposals that should logically be merged."

"Encourage SCRSG members to draw on all of the MPA ideas to date to develop their Round 3 MPA proposals, including borrowing and incorporating ideas from external proposals as useful and appropriate."

Analysis: What they are saying is that all the work, all the hard-fought compromises had resulted in something the enviro side didn't like. The in-your-face approach of including External C going forward backfired. They are trying the back-door approach of changing the rules on the RSG. Now, the ideas of External C, including the possibility of the BRTF requiring that External C as the starting place for Round 3 negotiations, are there.

Why the f&ck did the RSG do all the work and compromise in round 2 for if they are now required to go back and rehash on the ones they rejected. This guts the whole notion of "winnowing" the proposals if the powers-that-be can tell the participants to consider the ideas in the rejected proposals after the rejected proposal was voted out. This wiped out any gain our consumptive RSGs made but forced them to live with any compromise they gave up on to get to consensus in their gem group.

The starting line now is the compromised maps (which our consumptive RSGs gave up some here and there to get to concensus) and THE IDEAS of the extreme map (e.g., External C). Not explicit External C map, but all of its ideas are now put back in the process. In other words, the enviros didn't compromise on their External C. It's still brutally oppressive for consumptives. And its concepts are allowed to move forward. Look at the external C map. That means the concept of a huge closure off La Jolla, off Point Loma, off the entire Laguna/OC coast, off the most used reefs in the Santa Barbara area, of huge swaths of the islands, are now back in consideration and the RSGs must deal with them again. I'd be dancing if I were on the enviro side--money does buy everything.

By the way, this is a huge change in operating procedure and the whole RSG is in chaos. I've spoken to a few after this, and they are in confusion. Not because they are not smart but because they are being gamed again, and the rules are shifting--WTF are the ground rules now?

And don't ignore the obvious slamming of the consumptives for "block voting" and intimidation. What a crock of sh$t. That will be their rally cry going into the third round.

Bottomline: This is still smoke and mirror. They are backing off the in-your-face approach and trying the cutesy backdoor approach to sneak the ideas and concepts of the rejected External C back in.

Some RSGs feel this is even more insidious. Either way, it wiped out their work in the previous round.

Stay tuned. We are revising strategy to deal with this. But you must go still and point out the problems. They hope this will take the wind out of our sail. One RSG member pointedly say that you guys (the rank-and-file fishermen and spearos gearing up and the prospect of hundreds of angry fishermen showing up to hammer the point home) forced their hands. They are counting on us being stupid not to see it. Smack 'em. See you Thursday.

[Oside]

I wish I could make this one, and the last one, but I very recently started my own business, and cannot afford the day off, gas money, or time to go up there on a Thursday morning...(if I did I would be hitting up Duane or Mason for a Wednesday Barrett Ticket, and heading up there Thursday, and hitting the Kelp Friday)
Good Luck up there, but please don't judge guys that really do care, but can't make it. We are behind you 100%.
:redi-dream:

[steamroll]

I'm heading up with Moyer, Sammons and Drew.

[dirfter]

Well, he (Pete) did write a piece yesterday for the LA Times: http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outposts/2009/06/mlpa-process-getting-more-than-a-little-bit-fishy-profishing-groups-claim.html

[USMC9999]

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outposts/2009/06/mlpa-process-getting-more-than-a-little-bit-fishy-profishing-groups-claim.html

Wow, after reading the comments posted about the written article I am just dumbstruck. Total and complete polarisation. These groups will never, ever see eye-to-eye and will always remain adversaries. Scary.

One side (enviros) sees this article as completely one-sided even when it only reports about what transpired regarding re-instatement of C.

Un-frikkin-believable. Nothing has changed.

[dirfter]

Gotta love the flatter portrayal of fishermen from today's article (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outposts/2009/06/mlpa-initiative-a-schwarzenegger-priority-budget-woes-notwithstanding.html)(brace yourself Doug, more kelp hugger soup on the table).

[AFRAN]

QUESTION:

When are the Shimanos, Daiwas, Calstars and Seekers (ETC) of this coast line going to take a stand? When are they going to pump ani-MLPA marketing dollars into this?

It should be all over the news and AM talk radio. I only heard about it once on 600AM with Roger Hedgecock.

I think the big company's should set up. There connected to the top.

[BEEJ]

QUESTION:

When are the Shimanos, Daiwas, Calstars and Seekers (ETC) of this coast line going to take a stand? When are they going to pump ani-MLPA marketing dollars into this?

It should be all over the news and AM talk radio. I only heard about it once on 600AM with Roger Hedgecock.

I think the big company's should set up. There connected to the top.

I feel that the millions of marketing dollars they would need to pump into this thing to make the difference is not worth it to them when comparing that to the amount they will lose by this section of waters being closed down. SHimano is global, and I have to imagine the bulk of their money is not from us SoCal guys fishing these target areas. Sure it is a large chunk, but not the bulk. They will still profit immensely regardless of the closures here. Seeker, Calstar, much of that is offshore driven so they are alright for now. I don't see these guys stepping in until much later when this spreads across the globe. If anything these comapanies may turn a bigger profit if all the inshore guys are now forced to go fish freshwater. We will have to get all new gear to target the new species.. Just my thoughts on the "big guys".

[AFRAN]

You would have to HOPE Shimano would step up for the fishing community, especially since they have offices in CA.

Ton of companies in Cali. It would benefit them to get involved, regardless of offshore or inshore.


Someone get OBAMA on the phone, I need some HOPE

[USMC9999]

Gotta love the flatter portrayal of fishermen from today's article (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outposts/2009/06/mlpa-initiative-a-schwarzenegger-priority-budget-woes-notwithstanding.html)(brace yourself Doug, more kelp hugger soup on the table).


Looks like I'll have to wait untill tomorrow for more replies as there are only two up as of now. Oh joy!

I just know this is going to go the way it did when this happened in the Channel Islands. But at least this time our side is fighting back somewhat more effectively even though it is still my contention it is a rigged game.

[USMC9999]

Someone get OBAMA on the phone, I need some HOPE

I'd rather that Chairman Mao was called to the phone. We need some results.

As Beej stated: the tackle companies don't see this as an overriding impact for their worldwide sales etc.
Hell, Shimano can just make more bicycle gears/de-railers for the increased demand for mountain bikes that the ex-users of their reels will be buying to make up for the lost revenues in reel sales as a result of this.:idiot:

[bluefin2na]

the ASA is fighting for the tackle guys


whos goingup in the AM

[AFRAN]

the ASA is fighting for the tackle guys


whos goingup in the AM

The RADIOSILENCE Crew (out of Long Beach) is going to be up there.

[bluefin2na]

i,m leaving COP at 6:30 AM with Oolieeeeeee

i got room for 2 more

breakfast on me

[steamroll]

breakfast on me

Inappropriate

See you up there Tommy

[PunkRockCPA]

QUESTION:

When are the Shimanos, Daiwas, Calstars and Seekers (ETC) of this coast line going to take a stand? When are they going to pump ani-MLPA marketing dollars into this?

It should be all over the news and AM talk radio. I only heard about it once on 600AM with Roger Hedgecock.

I think the big company's should set up. There connected to the top.

Tommy is correct (what else is new!). Shimano and all the "mfgs" are fighting the battle through a common rep - ASA. Sounds like an efficient way to handle it. They ARE involved and concerned.

Yes, Shimano is a global company, but it's North American President lives in So Cal and LOVES fishing all of the threatened areas for everything from bass to marlin. He's been working on this issue since it wasn't a concern in your eye. He was concerned and organizing on it when they were just starting to dicuss the begininng of this process.

Bob Hoose (Pure Fishing, aka Berkley, etc.), who's primary job for Berkly seems to be spending nearly 300 days a year on the water. He's concerned and I seriously doubt he is sitting idol. Pure Fishing spends TONS of money on this coast trying to get us to use their products. The So. Cal market is not the biggest fishing market in the US, but it is significant. The manufacturers are present.

WAR, why are you trying to portray them and the other manufacturers as some kind of uncaring corporate structures? None of these companies want to lose this market (especially to enviros).



This is the problem with the internet, people railing against shit they don't know.

[PunkRockCPA]

TOMMY, NATE, OOLIE, and EVERYBODY ELSE who is making the trek to LA today...
THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.





It really sucks that they host these wonderful parties during the day when most average working-class joes (read as: your basic average sportsman profile!) CAN'T make it. Good luck men, we are counting on you!

[bluefin2na]

I just spent 4 plus hours in my truck with Oolieee..

holy crap

[birdie]

I just spent 4 plus hours in my truck with Oolieee..

holy crap

and did you have the answers he seeks?

how'd the meeting go? good turnout?

[pal_11]

Incredible turnout! A tactical victory too, a win for sticking to the agreed process - Ext C is out of this round's science evaluation and workshops.

Re: Shimano and other tackle companies. They are providing the big dollars behind the ASA / PSO effort, including employing a lobbyist ($$$). Although you don't see many of their reps at the meetings, they are in the game.

[Holy Mackerel]

Good seeing Dr fter, and Oooooolie there!!!! As well as many others!
i
Remember, we are all working stiffs, make the time, take it.. I work Mon-Fri, 7am-4pm, no flexibility.

My deer hunting trip this fall is dwindling in days, in fact, I have no days left to spend a week at Lake Almanor with my family, and good friends. I need to accumulate hours each month, so I can go, but I will continue to use them as for these meetings.

[birdie]

good to hear...thanks for your time and effort guys...we appreciate it

[dirfter]

My ears are still sore from the applause for PAL! Nice. Unfortunately I had to leave right after that. Does anyone know where/when the video converage will be available for viewing?

oOlie, get that test from me.

Tommy, my plumber left town. You have a good reference? She-male me.